User blog:Magatsu Hades/1-A Persona Respect Thread
Introduction So, i have seen lots and lots of downgrades in multiple verses, and Persona, being my favorite, is one of them as well. That is unacceptable, so i will correct it. Okay. Let's get to it. First, however, You should read this, since it's the main focus of the stuff that i'm gonna explain right now. Several Terms Before going to explaining why Persona is 1-A, i will have to explain some terms. Shadow: A common term that you will all hear in the Persona games. Shadows are the lower parts of the psyche everyone has... Suppressed human thoughts given physical form. When people are unable to face their darker selves, they break loose, free from all control. But sometimes, humans with special awareness can tame their Shadows, those are the Persona users. Shadow are mainly born from humans, and carry with them human emotions, which are mostly negative. Velvet Room: A room that exists between consciousness and subconsciousness, as well as transcend them as well. A place that exists between dream and reality, mind and matter, as well as transcend them, the Velvet Room is a place that was created by Philemon, and hosted by Igor, and the several Velvet Room Denizens that exist throughout the Persona games. According to the Official Megami Tensei Wiki, the Velvet Room transcend dream and reality. The Collective Unconsciousness: A realm connected to every living being's sub-conscious mind. And within the Collective Unconsciousness dwells Shadows, which as explained above, are fragments of human psyche. The Collective Unconsciousness and The Sea Of Souls are connected together, where The Sea of Souls is basically the afterlife of the Persona series. The Sea Of Souls: A place that is linked to the Collective Unconsciousness, where the souls of the dead return to once they die, this in turn means that the Sea Of Souls, and in turn the Collective Unconsciousness, is basically the afterlife of the Persona Franchise. Metaverse: An independent dimension that holds the Palaces of others once a distorted desire becomes strong enough in Mementos to repel the authority of the Holy Grail in order to have a place independent from Mementos, which is commonly called a Palace. According to Shadow Shido, Palace Owners that reside in the Metaverse are merely convicts, whose distorted desires caused them to be sent away from Mementos to the Metaverse, where stealing the Treasure of a Palace Owner would cause them to immediately return to Mementos. According to Morgana, The Cognitive World of one human exists inside Mementos as a substantial world, or a parallel universe. Additionally, in Persona 1, Nanjo stated that the worlds in the Collective Unconsciousness follows the Theory of Many Worlds, or the Many Worlds Interpretation, where there exists countless parallel worlds inside the Collective Unconsciousness. Mementos: The Super Palace of All Humanity that houses all the desires of all humans, Mementos is presented in Persona 5, where the Shadows of other people where Morgana stated that it's in the same concept as the Collective Unconsciousness. All Cognitive Palaces of other people sprout from Mementos, where leaving a Treasure Bud would result in the creation of a Palace independent from Mementos, which is automatically sent immediately to the Metaverse. According to Morgana, Mementos is maintained by the Collective Unconsciousness. According to the Holy Grail, the desires that praises it are infinite, which in turn means that there are infinite cognitive desires inside Mementos, which in turn means that Mementos is a singular realm made up of infinite human desires. Additionally, according to Philemon, The desires in the Collective Unconsciousness can change the reality, and even will new ones in it, where people's unconsciousness has a tremendous power inside their soul over the flow of reality, as well as the fact that the willpower of someone has the ability to create a new reality in the Collective Unconsciousness. Science in our lives have stated that willpower is connected to desire. So as long as you 'desire' something, your will to do it will be strong, and in turn, this means that Desire is connected to Willpower, and vice versa. Treasure: The corrupted hearts all appear as treasures for the Phantom Thieves to steal, and when the treasures are successfully stolen the corrupted adults will feel remorse for their actions. Initially they appear as a formless cloud of rainbow energy, as the Palace's host is not focused on how they could lose it. However, if the host feels "threatened" of having a secret exposed, their treasure takes on a physical form, usually something related to the source of their ego. The Phantom Thieves achieve this by issuing a calling card directly to the palace's owner in the real world. Once taken out of the Palace, the host's world collapses into nothingness and the Treasure becomes a mundane but valuable item which the Thieves sell to finance themselves. The host then suffers from a great personality change that can arrange from thoroughly apologizing their crimes to completely recovering from their depression. This, in turn means, that Treasures are the centers of palaces, they along with their rulers passively sustain the palace that formed from them. However, Philemon stated that people's willpower, aka their ego, aka their Shadow selves, can create and reshape realities, where a Shadow, which is the inner soul power, is enough to control the flow of reality. Another proof to this theory is that Philemon also stated that the power that created the universe is the same as that of a human's inner strength. Meaning that when a Palace is formed, it is actually the size of a universe, but the Palace owner is only focused on his own desires that their focus is solely on one place (Kamoshida viewing the school as a castle, Madarame viewing a museum in Shibuya as his own, Kaneshiro viewing all of Shibuya town as his own bank, Okumura viewing his company as a huge space station surrounded with stars and nebula and Shido viewing the Diet Building as a huge luxury cruise that sails on a drowned version of Japan) , which in turn means that it's not by the size of the place, but it all depends on the willpower of a person to will a Palace in the Metaverse (As shown when it was seen that Okumura's Palace was a spaceport that contained multiple stars, and was labelled as Multi-Solar System in size, but Shido, who is superior in power to Okumura, had his Palace being the size of a drowned version of Japan, with a cruise holding the Diet Building sailing on the water). Cognition: To put it more bluntly, Cognition, according to Morgana, is the ability to turn desires and thoughts into reality, where Cognition refers to the concept of human perceiving the world and viewing what they see as reality. When enough humans collectively perceive something that concept becomes "real," influencing both the world and themselves. This concept is strongly hinted to be related to previous situations seen in Persona games. To put it even more bluntly, The concept of Cognition and Morgana's speech after the final battle strongly suggest Cognition is Persona's equivalent to Observation in Shin Megami Tensei, where Observation is the ability humans possess to give structure to the formless. In this instance, "observation" has nothing to do with sight, but rather human perception. It is an extension of the philosophical concept of "Qualia", or individual, subjective experiences. For example, the sensation of seeing color is not easily communicated, yet something humanity possess a shared understanding of. On another note to this, Observation was stated to be extension of the philosophical concept of "Qualia", which in turn means, the Qualia Space, as well as the fact that Cognition is the equivalent of Observation. This would mean that the Persona verse is a Quantum Multiverse, where concepts as Wave Functions and Qualia Space existing in it, where the act of observation causes reality to "choose" between several possibilities which all existed simultaneously prior to being observed. On another note, The Qualia Space is stated to be infinite-dimensional in nature and resemble the concept of Hilbert Space. And since Observation = Cognition, then this means that Persona Verse is a Quantum Multiverse with the same concepts of Shin Megami Tensei games, which are the Wave Function Collapse, and the Qualia Space. To prove more that Observation = Cognition, Morgana stated after the defeat of Yaldabaoth that the world as we know it is a product of Cognition, which can be freely re-made through the thoughts of a mere human, which in turn means that someone can will something into reality with his/her own desire alone. Simply put, Cognition is actually Observation, but with the mere difference that their names are changed in both Shin Megami Tensei and Persona, which in turn means that the cosmology of most of ATLUS' games (Excluding a few like Catherine), are the same. After THE Math (I didn't mean Aftermath) So, after all of this, as well as the fact that i scaled all of the Persona games from Persona 1, 2 and 5, and didn't even mention Persona 3 and 4, which is mainly because it's the same, what do i mean by all of that? Well, remember the thread from above in the Introduction section? It has relation to this. You see, ATLUS has the tendency to bring forth a game with multiple choices, which is something that we have here in both Shin Megami Tensei and Persona games. And those are examples: Persona 3 Bad Ending (Should the protagonist agrees to kill Ryoji) Persona 4 Bad Endings (Excluding the True Ending from it) Persona 5 Bad Endings (What happens when you do not clear the heists in the past, which will cause the protagonist to succumb to the drugs, where in turn would cause Akechi to kill him, as well as the fact whether or not he decides to expose his friends to Sae or not, and add to this his decision on whether or not agreeing to Yaldabaoth's deal to reset the whole world) As you can see in those videos, the Persona verse heavily depends on the player's decisions, where his decision would heavily affect the outcome that will happen in the future, be it good or bad. And this, my dear readers, is the Schrodinger's Cat Theory. (1) Next, we have the Collective Unconsciousness, which is linked to the Sea Of Souls, where there are infinite amounts of souls in it from the claim of the Holy Grail, which takes the shape of stars as you can see. This would mean that the Sea of Souls, and in turn the Collective Unconsciousness must be infinite in size to take all of those souls. And remember, Philemon stated that a single soul can create a reality of its own, which in turn means that there are infinite parallel worlds inside the Sea of Souls, as well as the fact that in Persona 5, The Metaverse works by storing the distorted subconscious desires of people into it, where Palaces would be made of variable size. And this is no hyperbole where Nanjo stated in Persona 1 that the Collective Unconsciousness works on the Theory of Many Worlds, or the Many Worlds Interpretation Theory, where countless (Limitless) worlds in the Collective Unconsciousness are the souls in it parallel to each other, which can create realities as stated by Philemon himself in Persona 2. Nanjo's words themselves support the Holy Grail's words of the existence of infinite cognitive desires within Mementos, or the Collective Unconsciousness, since both of them are one and the same (Or at the very least, similar in the structure of existence). And this. my dear readers, is the Many World Interpretations Theory. (2) Conclusion Now, after all of that, what is my conclusion to all of this? Simple. If you saw (1) and (2), read what was above them, and compared them to the thread in the Introduction section, then we will soon get to the realization that Persona (And by extension, Shin Megami Tensei franchise) is an Infinite-Dimensional World. So that means High 1-B Persona. Buuuuuuut.... The embodiment of the Collective Unconsciousness (Which are the final bosses of each Persona game) are transcendent to the Persona verse as a whole, where Yaldabaoth is the core of Mementos itself, which is the same as the Collective Unconsciousness, where the Collective Unconsciousness is connected to the Sea Of Souls, which, as i have stated above, is basically the Heaven of the Persona series, which in turn means that the entities that are the embodiment of the Collective Unconsciousness are basically above the reality of the Persona verse, which is infinite-dimensional in nature of existence, which means that Yaldabaoth, and the final bosses of each Persona game, is 1-A straight. No objections! Another example out of this is Izanami from Persona 4, where she resides in Yomotsu Hirasaka inside the Midnight Channel, where it is stated to be The Underworld of the Persona series, or basically, The Hell of the Persona series, and this is legit, considering the fact that the Megami Tensei franchise without exception follows the various mythologies in it, with not only the description of demons and gods, but also the places and locations in the verses as a whole. Nyx, in Persona 3, is the embodiment of Death in a physical form the size of a celestial body that existed outside the observant reality, and since she is the concept of death, then that means that she scales to it as well. Nyarlathotep and Philemon in Persona 2 are the embodiment of the Collective Unconsciousness as a whole, so they also scale to this. Pandora, in Persona 1, is the manifestation of Maki's nihilism, and she was going to use the DEVA System to turn the whole reality into nothingness, where the whole reality, as i explained, is an infinite-dimensional world, so she scales to it as well. Scalings 1- Pandora (Persona 1): Is Maki's ultimate expression of nihilism, and was going to use the DEVA System to turn the infinite-dimensional reality of Persona into nothingness. 2- Nyarlathotep and Philemon (Persona 2): The embodiment of the Collective Unconsciousness as a whole, which is basically the afterlife and the Heaven of the Persona verse, which means it's above the infinite-dimensional world of Persona. 3- Nyx (Persona 3): The embodiment of Death in Persona. 4- Izanami (Persona 4): The creator of the Midnight Channel, which is the source of the Collective Unconsciousness, where she resides in Yomotsu Hirasaka, which is the Hell version of Persona. 5- Yaldabaoth (Persona 5): The very core of Mementos, which means that he is the embodiment of it, where Mementos is stated by Morgana to be the same as the Collective Unconsciousness, as well as the fact that Mementos is maintained by the Collective Unconsciousness as well, where the Collective Unconsciousness is linked to the Sea Of Souls, which is basically the afterlife, or the Heaven of the Persona series as a whole. Also, Yaldabaoth is able to casually destroy and recreate reality at will, with only a thought. He also fused The Velvet Room and the infinite-dimensional reality of Persona with Mementos. 6- Naoya Toudou (Persona 1): With his Ultimate Persona, Amen-Ra, only, was able to harm and defeat Pandora alongside his friends. 7- Tatsuya Suou (Persona 2): Fought against Nyarlathotep, who controls and embodies the entire Collective Unconsciousness alongside Philemon. Strong enough to leave a bruise on Philemon's cheek, who is equal to Nyarlathotep. 8- Minato Arisato (Persona 3): With his Ultimate Persona, Messiah and Universe Arcana, only, was able to hold himself against Nyx, who nearly one-shot him, and was able to seal Nyx away using the Great Seal. 9- Yu Narukami (Persona 4): With his Ultimate Persona, Izanagi-no-Okami, only, one-shot Izanami-no-Okami with Myraid Truths. 10- Akira Kurusu (Persona 5): With his Ultimate Persona, Satanael, only, one-shot Yaldabaoth with the Sinful Shell. 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